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batum vs george

Postby spud_webb_04 » Fri May 11, 2012 7:35 am

I like both players alot in real life and fantasy
who do you think is better or will be better fantasywise?
if you could keep one of them which one would you keep in a dynasty format ?
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Re: batum vs george

Postby RedHopeful » Fri May 11, 2012 7:27 pm

Wow, tough choice. Right now, I've gotta give the nod to Batum. He finally came of age this past season putting a lot of questions to rest about whether he'd ever live up to his potential. Coincidentally, I sort of view George like I did Nicolas a few years back - would he ever cash in on the talent and end up a fantasy stud. George has all the gifts but can he take that major next step like Batum? One thing that hurts him or might keep him down for several years is the surrounding talent. It'd probably take a situation similar to what happened in Portland where all the studs went down 1 by 1 and gave Batum the opportunity to be the man.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby spud_webb_04 » Sat May 12, 2012 12:17 am

Thanks for your opinion.
I feel that george might explode once granger leaves Indiana. Bird already said that paul is the most talented pacer.
He indeed has all the talent and tools to be a (fantasy) stud and i see him becoming one of the 1 1 1 club soon.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby Muharem23 » Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:54 pm

RedHopeful wrote:Wow, tough choice. ... George has all the gifts but can he take that major next step like Batum? One thing that hurts him or might keep him down for several years is the surrounding talent.


Not a tough choice. if you're trying to win you have to keep Batum over George. Batum has an incredible opportunity in Portland now that pretty much, anyone that counted fantasy wise is gone... I expect an incredible jump in Batums fantasy stats (think RL most improved player). Yes true George does have all the talents necessary to someday flourish... But when will that someday be? Pacers are loaded with people that do everything. Even the bench. So unless significant changes happen in Indiana between now and week 1, I'd pick Batum over George anyway.

Fortunately for me, I own both and can keep both! :-D
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Re: batum vs george

Postby RedHopeful » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:18 am

Muharem23 wrote:
RedHopeful wrote:Wow, tough choice. ... George has all the gifts but can he take that major next step like Batum? One thing that hurts him or might keep him down for several years is the surrounding talent.


Not a tough choice. if you're trying to win you have to keep Batum over George. Batum has an incredible opportunity in Portland now that pretty much, anyone that counted fantasy wise is gone... I expect an incredible jump in Batums fantasy stats (think RL most improved player). Yes true George does have all the talents necessary to someday flourish... But when will that someday be? Pacers are loaded with people that do everything. Even the bench. So unless significant changes happen in Indiana between now and week 1, I'd pick Batum over George anyway.

Fortunately for me, I own both and can keep both! :-D

Interesting. Why is Batum such a lock considering this is a dynasty format? I can easily envision where George absolutely kills it in Indy in say two years max. Either Granger goes down with a serious injury or is off the team. Meanwhile, Batum doesn't have anywhere close to a type A personality. He's already a #2 option behind Aldridge and it's not hard to fathom he'll be a 3 when Lillard takes off.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby Muharem23 » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:28 am

RedHopeful wrote:...George has all the gifts but can he take that major next step like Batum? One thing that hurts him or might keep him down for several years is the surrounding talent. It'd probably take a situation similar to what happened in Portland where all the studs went down 1 by 1 and gave Batum the opportunity to be the man.


It'll take a perfect storm to get George into that situation where he'll be the #2 scoring option. Batum is already there. I don't think either of these guys will ever be #1 on their team with scoring but they'll do 1-1-1's every game. I think the Pacers won't blow their roster up in the near future. Right now Batums situation is much better like you said yourself. I do believe George will get there one day, not soon enough though... If you can keep both, do it...
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Re: batum vs george

Postby RedHopeful » Mon Aug 13, 2012 3:37 pm

Muharem23 wrote:
RedHopeful wrote:...George has all the gifts but can he take that major next step like Batum? One thing that hurts him or might keep him down for several years is the surrounding talent. It'd probably take a situation similar to what happened in Portland where all the studs went down 1 by 1 and gave Batum the opportunity to be the man.


It'll take a perfect storm to get George into that situation where he'll be the #2 scoring option. Batum is already there. I don't think either of these guys will ever be #1 on their team with scoring but they'll do 1-1-1's every game. I think the Pacers won't blow their roster up in the near future. Right now Batums situation is much better like you said yourself. I do believe George will get there one day, not soon enough though... If you can keep both, do it...

Pretty much agree. Was only trying to point out that for a dynasty league, it's not as easy of a choice as you made it out to be. Batum could have the value edge on George for perhaps the next 1-2 years but George could have then at least the next 5-7.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby Fenris-77 » Wed Aug 15, 2012 1:46 am

Even for dynasty I think I'll take Batum there without thinking too hard. I do really like Paul George mind you, but I think the fact that Batum is far liklier to put up great numbers over the next couple of years makes him the guy. He's got trade value and fantasy value over that stretch and there are lots of ways he can help a team. I wouldn't rag on someone for going long term with George, but Batum's skill set for fantasy is high enough that I probably wouldn't make that choice. I'd also be really pleased if my team was so good that choosing between Batum and George was my biggest problem. :-b

I guess the break point might be where the team making the choice is at from a contention standpoint. A better team, one that might be able to win a league this year or the next, should go with Batum, but a team that is still rebuilding and taking a longer view might be better served with George.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby jphanned » Wed Aug 15, 2012 2:02 am

I'll be the contrarian I guess. I'll take George over Batum long- AND short-term. Batum will take an "incredible jump" in production this year? Why? Because Crash is gone? Because they added Lillard? Don't really see a reason to buy an impending breakout. Batum & George put up identical per-game value last year, and of the two I think it's George who is the greater talent with the higher ceiling. The Pacers will eventually realize there's a glass ceiling with their current group, and the only way to further improve would be to deal Granger. Don't really need to spell out what that would mean for George - "incredible jump" is a start.
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Re: batum vs george

Postby Fenris-77 » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:07 am

The main difference for me is that Batum has done more with less help around him than George has. There isn't a huge difference in usage between the two, but Indy had much better weapons last year than Portland did, and George reaped the benefits. If the Pacers do actually decide to move Granger it might provide a nice leg up for George, but it also might decidedly not. Granger bore something like 26% of the Pacers offense last year and did so with slightly above-average efficiency (which is actually a pretty rare thing). If George is asked to bear a whole lot more possessions on offense there's no guarantee he'll look good doing it, especially when his efficiency this past year wasn't actually that great (108 ORat on 19.3 USG%). If you subtract some shooting efficiency from his line, and maybe some defensive counting stats based on his having to use a great deal more effort in other areas then you're not looking at a fantasy super-star.

Batum, on the other hand, will probably hold steady in his role and usage, which make him a more reliable bet to hold value. Again, it's not that I don't like George, because I do, I just think he's a more risk laden pick for a variety of reasons.
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