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2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby silentjim » Fri Sep 06, 2013 4:50 pm

I honestly just don't understand what happened from college to now that scares people off of McLemore. He slipped a bit in the draft? It happens all the time. GMs are stupid. Summer League? What does that really mean? Heck Adam Morrison played well in just the 2012 summer league, but that never translated, so to say a person who struggles in one is trash just seems odd.

Seems like every outlet made pseudo lazy comparisons to Ray Allen (who was a phenomenal college player), but even if he's half the player of Ray Allen, he's still fantasy viable.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby jphanned » Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:57 pm

silentjim wrote:I guess I'm confused why you're so down on him? A bad summer league? His numbers at Kansas were good, including his percentages.


How about 0 assists in 150+ minutes in Summer League? He was a poor passer at Kansas too, so unless you see huge categorical gains in his other categories, I don't get what the buzz is about. His fantasy ceiling isn't all that high.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby hi chi » Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:06 pm

I also worry about him being on the Kings. Even with Evans gone, there are still enough black holes on that team to hurt is value. The addition of Vasquez helps McLemore out, but I don't love the Kings for him as a destination.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby RedHopeful » Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:35 pm

hi chi wrote:I also worry about him being on the Kings. Even with Evans gone, there are still enough black holes on that team to hurt is value. The addition of Vasquez helps McLemore out, but I don't love the Kings for him as a destination.

Really? It's nothing like it's been in the past, and additionally, I expect the culture to significantly start changing for the best. Love Malone (new coach) and the Kings will have 2 anti-black holes in the starting lineup (Vasquez, Mbah a Moute). Lastly, McLemore's play-making skills won't be pressed as Greivis has shown he can handle the load.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby Phil O'Pastry » Sun Sep 08, 2013 6:33 am

^^^ Pretty much this.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby hi chi » Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:41 pm

RedHopeful wrote:
hi chi wrote:I also worry about him being on the Kings. Even with Evans gone, there are still enough black holes on that team to hurt is value. The addition of Vasquez helps McLemore out, but I don't love the Kings for him as a destination.

Really? It's nothing like it's been in the past, and additionally, I expect the culture to significantly start changing for the best. Love Malone (new coach) and the Kings will have 2 anti-black holes in the starting lineup (Vasquez, Mbah a Moute). Lastly, McLemore's play-making skills won't be pressed as Greivis has shown he can handle the load.


While I hope there will be a culture change in Sacramento, the man in the middle may make it difficult. The fact the McLemore doesn't pass the ball is sure to cause him issues with Cousins. I am also not sold that Vasquez isn't in a 50/50 spilt with IT2 who isn't the best distributor of the ball. Add Thorton and Salmons to the mix, I am not loving him in Sacramento. While McLemore is a talented player there are some major issues he has to overcome with the Kings and alot of other rookies sit ahead of him on the draft board, partly becuase of him being on the Kings.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby RedHopeful » Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:05 pm

hi chi wrote:
RedHopeful wrote:
hi chi wrote:I also worry about him being on the Kings. Even with Evans gone, there are still enough black holes on that team to hurt is value. The addition of Vasquez helps McLemore out, but I don't love the Kings for him as a destination.

Really? It's nothing like it's been in the past, and additionally, I expect the culture to significantly start changing for the best. Love Malone (new coach) and the Kings will have 2 anti-black holes in the starting lineup (Vasquez, Mbah a Moute). Lastly, McLemore's play-making skills won't be pressed as Greivis has shown he can handle the load.


While I hope there will be a culture change in Sacramento, the man in the middle may make it difficult. The fact the McLemore doesn't pass the ball is sure to cause him issues with Cousins. I am also not sold that Vasquez isn't in a 50/50 spilt with IT2 who isn't the best distributor of the ball. Add Thorton and Salmons to the mix, I am not loving him in Sacramento. While McLemore is a talented player there are some major issues he has to overcome with the Kings and alot of other rookies sit ahead of him on the draft board, partly becuase of him being on the Kings.

Let's get real here. It's not like McLemore can't literally make a pass. Comparing summer league to what may happen in the regular season is foolhardy. Yes, he's not going to be some stud playmaker out the gates (or likely ever), but he'll move the ball around enough.

I'm really just not getting this whole McLemore on the Kings is bad. He's got a better chance for production there than most other teams. Plus, it's silly to continue to point to past experiences when the roster/coach/management are significantly different.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby silentjim » Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:30 pm

RedHopeful wrote:
hi chi wrote:
RedHopeful wrote:Really? It's nothing like it's been in the past, and additionally, I expect the culture to significantly start changing for the best. Love Malone (new coach) and the Kings will have 2 anti-black holes in the starting lineup (Vasquez, Mbah a Moute). Lastly, McLemore's play-making skills won't be pressed as Greivis has shown he can handle the load.


While I hope there will be a culture change in Sacramento, the man in the middle may make it difficult. The fact the McLemore doesn't pass the ball is sure to cause him issues with Cousins. I am also not sold that Vasquez isn't in a 50/50 spilt with IT2 who isn't the best distributor of the ball. Add Thorton and Salmons to the mix, I am not loving him in Sacramento. While McLemore is a talented player there are some major issues he has to overcome with the Kings and alot of other rookies sit ahead of him on the draft board, partly becuase of him being on the Kings.

Let's get real here. It's not like McLemore can't literally make a pass. Comparing summer league to what may happen in the regular season is foolhardy. Yes, he's not going to be some stud playmaker out the gates (or likely ever), but he'll move the ball around enough.

I'm really just not getting this whole McLemore on the Kings is bad. He's got a better chance for production there than most other teams. Plus, it's silly to continue to point to past experiences when the roster/coach/management are significantly different.


Exactly. And lets get real from a fantasy standpoint you're not drafting him for assists in the first place. Right around 3.3 assists gets you a break even Z score and last season for pure SGs the only players to provide higher assists than that were Kobe, Mayo, and Redick. If I'm drafting McLemore its with the assumption he could potentially put up Kevin Martin (2012-2013) type of numbers at an above average return, a ceiling of Ray Allen and and or Kevin Martin in their best seasons (not necessarily this season), or a floor of just absolute garbage.
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby bujfan2030 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:54 pm

Here's how one of my rookie drafts (18 team salary cap) has gone thus far
1. LAC - Victor Olidapu
2. IND - Trey Burke
3. PHX - Ben McLemore
4. GSW - Anthony Bennett
5. POR - Otto Porter
6. GSW - Nerlens Noel
7. CHI - CJ McCollum
8. UTA - Michael Carter-Williams
9. DEN - Cody Zeller
10. TOR - Alex Len
11. SAN - Kelly Olynyk
12. LAC - Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
13. LAC - Dennis Schroeder
14. MIN - Shabazz Muhammad
15. NYK - Archie Goodwin
16. DEN - Luca Noguiera
17. GSW - Tim Hardaway jr
18. DEN - Steven Adams

19. MIL - Sergey Karasev
20. POR - Giannis Adetokunbo
21. GSW - Shane Larkin
What's interesting to me is that summer league hasn't had an impact on how people view Burke and McLemore. And maybe rightly considering it's a 5 or 6 game sample. With McLemore, it's hard to understand why a guy that some considered too passive would become such a chucker, unless perhaps his coaches asked him to be more aggressive as a scorer and he took things too far :-o . Something similar happened with MCW this summer. So I offer it as a remote possibility :-)
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Re: 2013 NBA Draft - Fantasy Fallout

Postby bujfan2030 » Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:40 am

Watched a few pre-season games tonight. Watched most of Sixers-Celtics to get an eye on Olynyk. His three is not very good right now.
The two i saw were set shots with a flat trajectory. He was tentative with his shot early and was off most of the night. His go to moves in Summer League(Dribble Spin into the paint and the Baby Hook) were mostly ineffective or led to turnovers. The game itself was sloppy and a bit helter skelter and he looked uncomfortable shooting much of the night. Jordan Crawford was the point a %-6 lot of Olynyk's minutes on the floor %-6. His rebounding is basically the same as in college. He'll have his man boxed out, but then ends up too close to the basket to get his hands on most boards. The defense is about as bad as expected. You can see him battling hard, and his pick and roll positioning was decent. But his over all team defense was atrocious. I suspect a few of Spencer Hawes open 3's were because Kelly got lost on his rotations. He got beat on the dribble often and didn't seem to know where to rotate once that happened.
Still, these are things he may get better at. He's a smart player.
the main bright spot was his passing: He made so many great passes which led to nice assists. And there were plenty of others that led to guys getting wide open jumpshots and 3's they didn't knock down. One other thing I liked. He was constantly in motion. Always looking to set screens and roll to the basket. I think once they get Rondo back he'll have an easier time getting to the Rim on those plays than he did tonight with Pressey and Crawford. I'm not totally worried about the shooting yet. And I'm heartened by the elite passing.

13 pts on 6-16 shooting,1-4 from 3, 2reb, 1 blk, 3stl, 1 ast(I swear it seemed like more) 2TO in 26 min
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